George From China - Dx 2007
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Lynette and George
Hope you are home in your own beds today
Cotton sheets do what is called wicking moisture away from you when you sweat
It is what I learned from camping in inclimate weather
When you are cold you become warm. When you are warm you become cooler
It was from scouting training with our kids
Here's to improvement and wellness
Love
Debbie
Hope you are home in your own beds today
Cotton sheets do what is called wicking moisture away from you when you sweat
It is what I learned from camping in inclimate weather
When you are cold you become warm. When you are warm you become cooler
It was from scouting training with our kids
Here's to improvement and wellness
Love
Debbie
Debbie
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Glad the operation went well. Please send Dr. Rolle my regards
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
I had my follow up MRI for the head a few days ago (will post results when available). I spoke with the tech, and she said my scan's resolution was 5mm. I'm not too impressed by that, actually. I will try to request a higher res protocol next time.
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
We were back home safely on Oct 2. George was tired but didn't need pain killers all the way. He didn't take any pain fillers now but he coughs and keep clearing his throat after the doctors cut off the 2 pills they said to help him cough. Anyway, it's getting better and he's feeling more strength day by day.D.ap wrote:Lynette and George
Hope you are home in your own beds today
Cotton sheets do what is called wicking moisture away from you when you sweat
It is what I learned from camping in inclimate weather
When you are cold you become warm. When you are warm you become cooler
It was from scouting training with our kids
Here's to improvement and wellness
Love
Debbie
He doesn't have night sweats at home. I thought it was because he was too weak, but now it looks like it has something to do with the mattress in the hospital.
Cheers,
Lynette
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
That makes sense. George's 8 mm resolution scan takes ~18 minutes, and your 5mm resolution takes 30~40 minutes. If you ask for a higher resolution, it may take 1 hour. This is not gonna happen here--too many peopleIvan wrote:I had my follow up MRI for the head a few days ago (will post results when available). I spoke with the tech, and she said my scan's resolution was 5mm. I'm not too impressed by that, actually. I will try to request a higher res protocol next time.
How is the result of your brain MRI? I really hope you can give us a good update when you find your time.
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Lynette and GeorgeWe were back home safely on Oct 2. George was tired but didn't need pain killers all the way. He didn't take any pain fillers now but he coughs and keep clearing his throat after the doctors cut off the 2 pills they said to help him cough. Anyway, it's getting better and he's feeling more strength day by day.
He doesn't have night sweats at home. I thought it was because he was too weak, but now it looks like it has something to do with the mattress in the hospital.
Cheers,
Lynette
Glad you are home safely!
Why do you think George was/is coughing ? Is he seeing his doctor at home soon?
I was glad to hear that the one tumor near the vessel was able to be removed without major surgery
I am glad he is able to be off the pain pills but he should use them if needed
Thanks for the update
Take care. Both of you
Love
Debbie
Debbie
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Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Dear Lynette,
Thank you for the thoughtful updates. I am so grateful that George's lung laser resection with Dr. Rolle went well and that you are now safely Home where he is recovering and regaining strength. Will he be resuming his TKI treatment now? Please give him and yourself special hugs from me and keep in touch with the Board as you are able.
Ivan, I will be anxiously awaiting your update with the results of your three month post-op brain MRI follow-up scan and holding very tight to Hope that the resected area is healing well with no tumor re-occurrence in the resected tumor bed and no new brain mets.
With special caring thoughts, healing wishes, and continued Hope,
Bonni
Thank you for the thoughtful updates. I am so grateful that George's lung laser resection with Dr. Rolle went well and that you are now safely Home where he is recovering and regaining strength. Will he be resuming his TKI treatment now? Please give him and yourself special hugs from me and keep in touch with the Board as you are able.
Ivan, I will be anxiously awaiting your update with the results of your three month post-op brain MRI follow-up scan and holding very tight to Hope that the resected area is healing well with no tumor re-occurrence in the resected tumor bed and no new brain mets.
With special caring thoughts, healing wishes, and continued Hope,
Bonni
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Hi Debbie,
George started to cough the second day right after they cut off the 2 pills (help him to cough, according to the doctors there), so I told Dr. Rolle about this. But he said it's okay if the coughing is not too severe. The cough happens when he have deep breaths. George says it's just like the air he breaths in can't do down to the lower lobe and rush to go out, that's the reason he coughs. He doesn't want to go to a doctor. Anyway, it's getting better day by day.
Bonnie,
Considering the brain metastases is quite aggressive, we decide to resume Pazopanib after the surgery. He's been on it 10 days after the surgery. Our plan is to stop the TKIs if there is no new brain mets in these few months. What do you think?
Thanks,
Lynette
George started to cough the second day right after they cut off the 2 pills (help him to cough, according to the doctors there), so I told Dr. Rolle about this. But he said it's okay if the coughing is not too severe. The cough happens when he have deep breaths. George says it's just like the air he breaths in can't do down to the lower lobe and rush to go out, that's the reason he coughs. He doesn't want to go to a doctor. Anyway, it's getting better day by day.
Bonnie,
Considering the brain metastases is quite aggressive, we decide to resume Pazopanib after the surgery. He's been on it 10 days after the surgery. Our plan is to stop the TKIs if there is no new brain mets in these few months. What do you think?
Thanks,
Lynette
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
I just forgot to ask something.
Hello everyone,
when you guys have your tumor tissue tested, do you get a result of immunohistochemical Ki67? Usually, the Ki67 of ASPS is very low (<10%), but in some people this index can be as high as 30%--in this case, ASPS would be relatively aggressive.
What's the index of your case?
Hello everyone,
when you guys have your tumor tissue tested, do you get a result of immunohistochemical Ki67? Usually, the Ki67 of ASPS is very low (<10%), but in some people this index can be as high as 30%--in this case, ASPS would be relatively aggressive.
What's the index of your case?
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Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Dear Lynette,
If the Pazopanib is working to stabilize the progression of George's disease and prevent the development of new brain mets I would personally NOT recommend discontinuing the drug "if there is no new brain mets in these few months." There is a strong risk of rebound and disease progression when TKI drugs like Pazopanib and Cediranib are discontinued, which is why Brittany is continuing to take Cediranib even though she has thankfully had disease stability and no new tumors for 53 months since beginning the Cediranib Clinical Trial in April 2009. As Dr. Sawyer, her very knowledgeable Clinical Trial oncologist told us, Brittany may be macroscopically tumor free, but unfortunately probably not microscopically tumor free so that discontinuing the Cediranib could possibly result in disease progression and new tumors. As difficult as the side effects of the Cediranib are, we are unwilling to jeopordize Brittany's current disease stability by discontinuing the Cediranib so she will probably continue taking it until she develops resistance to the drug and disease progression, Cediranib becomes no longer available, or a permanent ASPS treatment and cure is found.
Regarding your question about immunohistochemical Ki67, I don't know/remember if this was tested in Brittany's tumor tissue and I don't have access to the report right now, but will check it later and let you know when I can. In the meantime, take care Lynette and know that my continued special caring thoughts and best wishes are with George and you.
With deepest caring, healing wishes for George, and continued Hope,
Bonni
If the Pazopanib is working to stabilize the progression of George's disease and prevent the development of new brain mets I would personally NOT recommend discontinuing the drug "if there is no new brain mets in these few months." There is a strong risk of rebound and disease progression when TKI drugs like Pazopanib and Cediranib are discontinued, which is why Brittany is continuing to take Cediranib even though she has thankfully had disease stability and no new tumors for 53 months since beginning the Cediranib Clinical Trial in April 2009. As Dr. Sawyer, her very knowledgeable Clinical Trial oncologist told us, Brittany may be macroscopically tumor free, but unfortunately probably not microscopically tumor free so that discontinuing the Cediranib could possibly result in disease progression and new tumors. As difficult as the side effects of the Cediranib are, we are unwilling to jeopordize Brittany's current disease stability by discontinuing the Cediranib so she will probably continue taking it until she develops resistance to the drug and disease progression, Cediranib becomes no longer available, or a permanent ASPS treatment and cure is found.
Regarding your question about immunohistochemical Ki67, I don't know/remember if this was tested in Brittany's tumor tissue and I don't have access to the report right now, but will check it later and let you know when I can. In the meantime, take care Lynette and know that my continued special caring thoughts and best wishes are with George and you.
With deepest caring, healing wishes for George, and continued Hope,
Bonni
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
I am not sure why there is an assumption that pazopanib crosses blood-brain barrier? Lynette - I just read your excellent answer to kajer where you point out that "we don't know if Sutent can go through her Blood Brain Barrier to work on the brain mets." The same applies to pazopanib (and cediranib or any TKI) - or did I miss any relevant publication? The absence of new brain mets in Brittany case being on cediranib could not be a proof because we know numerous cases when there were single digit brain ASPS mets - resected/gamma knifed - gone and no new brain mets without any systemic treatment. On the other hand since we know that there are the cases of the brain mets bleeding on the TKI - could that be considered a proof that their do cross blood-brain barrier to be able to damage the feeding blood vessels and to cause the bleeding?
There is a full free text review about TKI in RCC http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22754592
Novel agents in renal carcinoma: a reality check.
and they conclude: "the role of these therapies in the treatment of brain metastases remains unclear"
It looks like TKI are able to reduce the incidence of the new brain mets in RCC and even improve the OS in it (we always look for a reference to this disease as they have more cases/more testing done and its clinical character is somehow resembles ASPS) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21484781 but it is a more aggressive/fast growing disease so the influence on the overall survival might be difference from ASPS - i.e. if the disease can kill the patient in 6 months and the drug gives a stability for 9 months you gain 3 months in OS, but if the disease can kill the patient in 3 years and the drug gives a stability for 9 months and grows faster after that - there might be a loss in OS not gain.
There is a big problem with TKI acquired resistance - it is hard to say what the result will be with in ASPS for the OS, when to use them, how to discontinue them etc.
About role of Ki67 in ASPS - as I understand it is an indicator for the probability to develop distant mets but not it being more aggressive. There is an older article:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10919382
We still have to result from Ivan's brain MRI. It is getting done slow in Canada. His brain surgeon was going to run all the tests on his brain met tissue removed last time but we did not get to see the results.
Alveolar soft part sarcoma: the role of prognostic markers.
"There was no correlation of these markers with prognosis or clinicopathologic parameters...Our preliminary data suggest that Ki-67-positive immunostaining may be a prognostic indicator for the development of metastases in ASPS."
Let me know if you have seen other articles on the subject.
Also you have to take into consideration that there is a very frequent genetic heterogeneity between the primary tumor and distant metastases and that CNS metastases and other - lungs, soft tissue ets. - are going to differ a lot as well, so to plan for the brain mets to be treated you would need to have a brain mets tissue etc. Hard.
There is a full free text review about TKI in RCC http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22754592
Novel agents in renal carcinoma: a reality check.
and they conclude: "the role of these therapies in the treatment of brain metastases remains unclear"
It looks like TKI are able to reduce the incidence of the new brain mets in RCC and even improve the OS in it (we always look for a reference to this disease as they have more cases/more testing done and its clinical character is somehow resembles ASPS) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21484781 but it is a more aggressive/fast growing disease so the influence on the overall survival might be difference from ASPS - i.e. if the disease can kill the patient in 6 months and the drug gives a stability for 9 months you gain 3 months in OS, but if the disease can kill the patient in 3 years and the drug gives a stability for 9 months and grows faster after that - there might be a loss in OS not gain.
There is a big problem with TKI acquired resistance - it is hard to say what the result will be with in ASPS for the OS, when to use them, how to discontinue them etc.
About role of Ki67 in ASPS - as I understand it is an indicator for the probability to develop distant mets but not it being more aggressive. There is an older article:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10919382
We still have to result from Ivan's brain MRI. It is getting done slow in Canada. His brain surgeon was going to run all the tests on his brain met tissue removed last time but we did not get to see the results.
Alveolar soft part sarcoma: the role of prognostic markers.
"There was no correlation of these markers with prognosis or clinicopathologic parameters...Our preliminary data suggest that Ki-67-positive immunostaining may be a prognostic indicator for the development of metastases in ASPS."
Let me know if you have seen other articles on the subject.
Also you have to take into consideration that there is a very frequent genetic heterogeneity between the primary tumor and distant metastases and that CNS metastases and other - lungs, soft tissue ets. - are going to differ a lot as well, so to plan for the brain mets to be treated you would need to have a brain mets tissue etc. Hard.
Olga
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Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Dear Lynette and Olga,
I agree that it is still unknown if all or any of the TKI drugs can cross the blood brain barrier to prevent new brain mets, and i am increasingly concerned about this issue based on Shelby's development of brain mets while she was taking Pazopanib and Verinostat and Katrina's development of a brain met while she was taking Cediranib. However, both Shelby and Katrina experienced disease progression with new tumors in other parts of their bodies in addition to the brain mets ( Shelby with a cervical muscle met and an upper spinal muscle met, and Katrina with a large liver met) so they had both apparently developed resistance to their TKI treatments. There is no way of knowing whether or not their TKI treatments had been crossing the blood brain barrier to prevent brain mets until the developed resistance occurred. Regarding Brittany's situation, she did not only have one isolated incident of a single digit brain met. Prior to her Cediranib treatment she had developed several new brain mets during a five year time period from 2004 to 2009 and the frequency of their development was rapidly increasing as her disease became more aggressive. The only thing that we know for certain is that Brittany has thankfully not had any new brain mets, or any new mets anywhere else in her body, thus far since beginning her Cediranib treatment in April 2009, and all traces of every one of her Gamma Knifed brain mets have completely disappeared which indicates to her radiologist, to her clinical trial oncologist, and to us that the Cediranib has crossed the blood brain barrier.
Olga, I'm so sorry for the frustrating delay in receiving the results of Ivan's follow-up brain MRI as I know how very stressful and anguishing the waiting for scan results is. My most positive thoughts, very best wishes, and greatest Hope are there with Ivan and you for good news results which I Hope that you will receive very soon.
With special caring thoughts, healing wishes for George and Ivan, and continued Hope,
Bonni
I agree that it is still unknown if all or any of the TKI drugs can cross the blood brain barrier to prevent new brain mets, and i am increasingly concerned about this issue based on Shelby's development of brain mets while she was taking Pazopanib and Verinostat and Katrina's development of a brain met while she was taking Cediranib. However, both Shelby and Katrina experienced disease progression with new tumors in other parts of their bodies in addition to the brain mets ( Shelby with a cervical muscle met and an upper spinal muscle met, and Katrina with a large liver met) so they had both apparently developed resistance to their TKI treatments. There is no way of knowing whether or not their TKI treatments had been crossing the blood brain barrier to prevent brain mets until the developed resistance occurred. Regarding Brittany's situation, she did not only have one isolated incident of a single digit brain met. Prior to her Cediranib treatment she had developed several new brain mets during a five year time period from 2004 to 2009 and the frequency of their development was rapidly increasing as her disease became more aggressive. The only thing that we know for certain is that Brittany has thankfully not had any new brain mets, or any new mets anywhere else in her body, thus far since beginning her Cediranib treatment in April 2009, and all traces of every one of her Gamma Knifed brain mets have completely disappeared which indicates to her radiologist, to her clinical trial oncologist, and to us that the Cediranib has crossed the blood brain barrier.
Olga, I'm so sorry for the frustrating delay in receiving the results of Ivan's follow-up brain MRI as I know how very stressful and anguishing the waiting for scan results is. My most positive thoughts, very best wishes, and greatest Hope are there with Ivan and you for good news results which I Hope that you will receive very soon.
With special caring thoughts, healing wishes for George and Ivan, and continued Hope,
Bonni
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
George had a MRI today. There is some progression. There is something (irregular) close to the skull, the radiologist mentioned it may be metastasis to meninges.
George is having some headache in the area that has something, but the thing is very small, just a few millimeters. It's really strange. So I'm guessing maybe it's the meninges met?
Does any one have metastasised to Meninges? I don't know what to do next...
George is having some headache in the area that has something, but the thing is very small, just a few millimeters. It's really strange. So I'm guessing maybe it's the meninges met?
Does any one have metastasised to Meninges? I don't know what to do next...
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
We had few cases with the brain mets to the skull (bone) or to the area just under or even to the soft tissue of the skull (muscles) on the outside. I would suggest to pursue the resection to get that tissue analyzed, the surgery should not be that difficult.
Olga
Re: George From China - Dx 2007
Lynette and George
Olga has a great suggestion. That way it will be removed and analyzed and you won't second guess what it is and isn't
Olga , is rebound growth limited to the lungs after removal of the lung mets in Germany ?
Stay strong you both
Many hugs coming your way.
Debbie
Olga has a great suggestion. That way it will be removed and analyzed and you won't second guess what it is and isn't
Olga , is rebound growth limited to the lungs after removal of the lung mets in Germany ?
Stay strong you both
Many hugs coming your way.
Debbie
Debbie